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Hardite info? Jordan 01-08-2008
Posted by on January 11, 2008, 4:23 pm
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 wrote:
> History suggests that diamonds which are pure carbon came out of the
> earth and cooled slowly.In case hardening, you are introducing carbon
> in higher percentages than in heat treatable carbon steel.
>
> If you follow the art of ancient swordmaking- look up Shotley Bridge
> in County Durham- you will find that the German finest swords were
> made by folding carbon into iron rather like making Swiss Rolls.the
> steel was so good that swords could be coiled into gentlemens' top
> hats.
> My father- who incidentally did his blacksmiths apprenticeship in the
> next village, used parings from horses hooves for case hardening!
>
> Yes?

Unfortunately it is not easy to produce the pressure required to form
diamonds in the workshop!

I take your point that the carbon content may be greater than for heat
treatable carbon steel but it is still necessary to cool rapidly
enough to prevent pearlite being formed instead of martensite. Perhaps
air cooling is rapid enough for a thin case?

Regarding the swords, the japanese were using this folding method to
make swords from about the 14th century. However they quenched the
edge to harden it while protecting the greater part of the blade with
clay to keep it tough.

Regards,
Russell.

Posted by Trevor Jones on January 11, 2008, 7:54 am
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 russell@eberhardt.org.uk wrote:
>
>>
>
>
>>I would imagine its much the same as any other CH powder (like
>>'casenit'). Heat item to cherry red and dip. Repeat as often as needed
>>for required 'depth' of hardness.
>>Don't know if stuff like this 'goes off' though - if its very old may
>>not be 100% effective. Is there a chemist in the group?
>>hth
>>Mike
>
>
> I've never understood how this can work. Surely the slow cooling in
> the powder can't give a really hard surface? I've always reheated and
> quenched.
> Russell.

AFAIK, with Kasenit, you repeat the red hot and dip process as many
times as you desire, and pound it into the quench on the last trip
through the cycle.

I have some, but have not used it for anything in anger, and that, a
while ago.

Cheers
Trevor Jones


Posted by ravensworth2674 on January 12, 2008, 5:36 am
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I haven't a clue of what went on in the Geisha World of Japan in the
14th Century but I know pretty well what went on in what was virtually
my own back door.

The word which comes to mind in an old unproven tin of 'jollop' is not
what it might do with a chunk of steel but whether it contains cyanide
for starters!

Come on- it's raw chemistry not physics!


Posted by Mark Rand on January 12, 2008, 8:16 am
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On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 02:36:42 -0800 (PST), ravensworth2674

>
>
>I haven't a clue of what went on in the Geisha World of Japan in the
>14th Century but I know pretty well what went on in what was virtually
>my own back door.
>
>The word which comes to mind in an old unproven tin of 'jollop' is not
>what it might do with a chunk of steel but whether it contains cyanide
>for starters!
>
>Come on- it's raw chemistry not physics!


There are major differences between cyanides and hexacyanoferrates. The
former are used in some plating baths, some gaseous and liquid hardening
processes and for killing religious nutters. The latter are used in case
hardening powders along with barium carbonate and as the anti caking agent in
icing sugar.

It's chemistry :-)


Mark Rand
RTFM

Posted by ravensworth2674 on January 12, 2008, 8:19 am
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> On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 02:36:42 -0800 (PST), ravensworth2674
>
>
> >I haven't a clue of what went on in the Geisha World of Japan in the
> >14th Century but I know pretty well what went on in what was virtually
> >my own back door.
>
> >The word which comes to mind in an old unproven tin of 'jollop' is not
> >what it might do with a chunk of steel but whether it contains cyanide
> >for starters!
>
> >Come on- it's raw chemistry not physics!
>
> There are major differences between cyanides and =A0hexacyanoferrates. The=

> former are used in some plating baths, some gaseous and liquid hardening
> processes and for killing religious nutters. The latter are used in case
> hardening powders along with barium carbonate and as the anti caking agent=
in
> icing sugar.
>
> It's chemistry :-)
>
> Mark Rand
> RTFM


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