Most Powerful Diesel Engine in the World - wear rates

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Most Powerful Diesel Engine in the World - wear rates Tim Nash (aka TMN) 07-20-2008
Posted by Tim Nash (aka TMN) on July 20, 2008, 4:00 am
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I sure by now most of us have looked at http://people.bath.ac.uk/ccsshb/12=
cyl/

I was looking at some documentation on the engine builders site and
came across this:
". The cylinder liner wear rates are in the region of 0.02=960.03 mm/
1000 hours maximum."

in the document:
http://www.wartsila.com/Wartsila/global/docs/en/ship_power/media_publicatio=
ns/marine_news/2000_3/rta96c_powerful_success.pdf

That equates to about 1 thou in 42 days - I don't now much about
internal combustion engines but that seems quite high. Is it because
of the large bore of the cylinders that the rings can cope with a
relatively large amount of cylinder and ring wear ?

Regards
Tim

Posted by moray on July 20, 2008, 4:23 am
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I sure by now most of us have looked at
http://people.bath.ac.uk/ccsshb/12cyl/

I was looking at some documentation on the engine builders site and
came across this:
". The cylinder liner wear rates are in the region of 0.02–0.03 mm/
1000 hours maximum."

in the document:
http://www.wartsila.com/Wartsila/global/docs/en/ship_power/media_publications/marine_news/2000_3/rta96c_powerful_success.pdf

That equates to about 1 thou in 42 days - I don't now much about
internal combustion engines but that seems quite high. Is it because
of the large bore of the cylinders that the rings can cope with a
relatively large amount of cylinder and ring wear ?

Regards
Tim


You've got to take it in proportion to bore size though.
For example -
1 thou on a 3" bore is equivalent to 0.0003% wear
1 thou on a 3' bore is equivalent to 0.000025% wear

moray



Posted by Dave Baker on July 20, 2008, 4:51 am
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Tim Nash (aka TMN) wrote:
> I sure by now most of us have looked at
> http://people.bath.ac.uk/ccsshb/12cyl/
>
> I was looking at some documentation on the engine builders site and
> came across this:
> ". The cylinder liner wear rates are in the region of 0.02-0.03 mm/
> 1000 hours maximum."
>
> in the document:
>
http://www.wartsila.com/Wartsila/global/docs/en/ship_power/media_publications/marine_news/2000_3/rta96c_powerful_success.pdf
>
> That equates to about 1 thou in 42 days - I don't now much about
> internal combustion engines but that seems quite high. Is it because
> of the large bore of the cylinders that the rings can cope with a
> relatively large amount of cylinder and ring wear ?

If you take 85mm as being the average bore of a car engine and 3 thou as a
reasonable bore wear limit before reconditioning then you get 33 thou wear
limit or 33,000 hours running for the 965mm bore of the Sulzer. That equates
to 3.7 years continuous running and container ships need to spend some time
loading and unloading so probably over 4 years actual service. Well within
their target of rebuilds every 2 to 3 years.

Compared to a car engine that's a very low rate of wear. Even a well looked
after car engine is unlikely to see more than 5000 hours service. The Sulzer
will undoubtedly have much better oil and air filtration systems than car
engines do though. Most car engine wear is caused by what gets past the air
filter or doesn't get removed from the oil. Truck engines with 500,000 mile
service lives also use much better filtration systems than cars.
--
Dave Baker


** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

Posted by Tim Nash (aka TMN) on July 20, 2008, 5:15 am
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> Tim Nash (aka TMN) wrote:
>
> > I sure by now most of us have =A0looked at
> >http://people.bath.ac.uk/ccsshb/12cyl/
>
> > I was looking at some documentation on the engine builders site and
> > came across this:
> > ". The cylinder liner wear rates are in the region of 0.02-0.03 mm/
> > 1000 hours maximum."
>
> > in the document:
> >http://www.wartsila.com/Wartsila/global/docs/en/ship_power/media_publ...
>
> > That equates to about 1 thou in 42 days - I don't now much about
> > internal combustion engines but that seems quite high. Is it because
> > of the large bore of the cylinders that the rings can cope with a
> > relatively large amount of cylinder and ring wear ?
>
> If you take 85mm as being the average bore of a car engine and 3 thou as =
a
> reasonable bore wear limit before reconditioning then you get 33 thou wea=
r
> limit or 33,000 hours running for the 965mm bore of the Sulzer. That equa=
tes
> to 3.7 years continuous running and container ships need to spend some ti=
me
> loading and unloading so probably over 4 years actual service. Well withi=
n
> their target of rebuilds every 2 to 3 years.
>
> Compared to a car engine that's a very low rate of wear. Even a well look=
ed
> after car engine is unlikely to see more than 5000 hours service. The Sul=
zer
> will undoubtedly have much better oil and air filtration systems than car
> engines do though. Most car engine wear is caused by what gets past the a=
ir
> filter or doesn't get removed from the oil. Truck engines with 500,000 mi=
le
> service lives also use much better filtration systems than cars.
> --
> Dave Baker
>
> ** Posted fromhttp://www.teranews.com**

Dave Baker said:

"4 years actual service. Well within
their target of rebuilds every 2 to 3 years."

OK - the figures make sense then - I thought that such a massive
engine would only be rebuilt every 10 years or so - but that was
a totally subjective figure. Guess I thought when you spend so much
money you don't have to worry about it for a long time !!! But seen in
light of the profits they must make its probably doesn't work out too
badly.

Tim

Posted by JC Morrice on July 20, 2008, 11:26 am
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In article <c61ffa41-e657-4ee7-a844-0a977c66614b@t54g2000hsg.googlegroup

>"4 years actual service. Well within
>their target of rebuilds every 2 to 3 years."
>
>OK - the figures make sense then - I thought that such a massive
>engine would only be rebuilt every 10 years or so - but that was
>a totally subjective figure. Guess I thought when you spend so much
>money you don't have to worry about it for a long time !!! But seen in
>light of the profits they must make its probably doesn't work out too
>badly.

Ten to twelve years is approaching the design service life of very large
commercial ships (maybe 15 at a push). They are build with multiple
redundant systems. Each system has a few years life. As systems fail,
backups are switched on - the original and subsequent failed systems are
left by-passed and switched off. No major component or system that
would cost mega-money and/or take the ship of the water is planned for
by it's original owner.

These types of engines are capable of being run with entire cylinders
not working, pistons missing, parts out for replacement etc, in a way
impossible for smaller engines. Also, there will be no reduction
gearbox to the propeller. Direct drive at propellor revs. Going in
reverse means stopping the engine and starting in the opposite
direction. No parts to wear out :)

When the ship is no longer viable to a first-world company, it is then
sold to a flag of convenience country and operated for the next X years
with very little, if no servicing done.

After 30/40 odd years use, on rejection as a rust-bucket by its tenth,
3rd World operator, the ship is in prime condition to be bought and
operated by a Greek shipping magnate.....................

Sometimes ships that touch our shores are served a writ. Basically they
must be serviced to a suitable standard before they move another inch.
The usual result is the captain, crew and vessel are abandoned by the
owners. It happens... and more than you think.............

John
--
JC Morrice
john@pentode.demon.co.uk

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