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Posted by Cliff Coggin on May 23, 2008, 10:09 am
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>
> A beginners thoughts:
>
> Most here seem to say buy blanks and grind your own.
>
> But, if you are a beginner isn't that just adding something else to learn
> and worry about? Is it not better for a beginner who already has a lathe
> to buy some ready to use tools so that they can get the hand of using the
> lathe first? Then later on learn to grind their own tools?
> AC
Even if you buy ready made tools they will rapidly need to be sharpened so
you would still need a grindstone and learn how to use it. One might as well
go the whole hog and grind your own from the start.
Cliff Coggin.
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Posted by Steve on May 23, 2008, 10:33 am
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>
>>I have a ml7 lathe and am about to buy a set of lathe tools and was
>> wondering what view others have regarding the best type, HSS or
>> Indexables
>
> A beginners thoughts:
>
> Most here seem to say buy blanks and grind your own.
>
> But, if you are a beginner isn't that just adding something else to learn
> and worry about? Is it not better for a beginner who already has a lathe
> to buy some ready to use tools so that they can get the hand of using the
> lathe first? Then later on learn to grind their own tools?
>
If you want to get straight to turning then, buy HSS tools ground to the
conventional shapes. Learn to keep them sharp to begin and in the
background, practice grinding your own.
I like Spareys book "The Amateurs Lathe". Some of it is out of date, I
find the the tool profiles work and I now only ever use carbide indexable
tip (not brazed tip) for cast iron and HSS for everything else. I don't use
any exotic materials in my projects (yet!).
So long story short, stick with HSS and learn to use the grinder. The
trickiest ones are the round nosed tools, but it's just patience and
practice in the end.
And a golden rule, if you haven't got the right profile tool, start with a
new blank, don't modify an existing one otherwise you end up never having
the right profile!!!
Steve
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Posted by Peter A Forbes on May 23, 2008, 8:25 am
Please log in for more thread options On Thu, 22 May 2008 02:43:58 -0700 (PDT), bert
>I have a ml7 lathe and am about to buy a set of lathe tools and was
>wondering what view others have regarding the best type, HSS or
>Indexables
Personally I prefer replaceable tip tools, and would have them anytime over
basic HSS blanks.
Nice to learn how to sharpen tools etc etc., but in practice I prefere to have a
new tip at the twist of an Allen key.
Peter
--
Peter A Forbes
Prepair Ltd, Rushden, UK
peterforbes@prepair.co.uk
http://www.prepair.co.uk
http://www.prepair.eu
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Posted by Steve on May 23, 2008, 10:36 am
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> On Thu, 22 May 2008 02:43:58 -0700 (PDT), bert
>
>>I have a ml7 lathe and am about to buy a set of lathe tools and was
>>wondering what view others have regarding the best type, HSS or
>>Indexables
>
> Personally I prefer replaceable tip tools, and would have them anytime
> over
> basic HSS blanks.
>
> Nice to learn how to sharpen tools etc etc., but in practice I prefere to
> have a
> new tip at the twist of an Allen key.
>
> Peter
> --
> Peter A Forbes
> Prepair Ltd, Rushden, UK
> peterforbes@prepair.co.uk
> http://www.prepair.co.uk
> http://www.prepair.eu
I started out with HSS blanks and grinding my own, bought a set of
indexable tips and now use HSS home ground again, leaving the carbide tips
for roughing cast iron. It's a hobby for me and the grinding I find a great
de-stresser! (not distressing). I find it easier to get a good finish with
sharp HSS rather than carbide.
Steve
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Posted by Dave Baker on May 23, 2008, 11:37 am
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> I started out with HSS blanks and grinding my own, bought a set of
> indexable tips and now use HSS home ground again, leaving the carbide
> tips for roughing cast iron. It's a hobby for me and the grinding I find
> a great de-stresser! (not distressing). I find it easier to get a good
> finish with sharp HSS rather than carbide.
>
> Steve
I might suggest you're not using the right carbide inserts then. To repeat,
yet again, something I've posted many times over the years. Most carbide
tips are designed for high powered machines and high volume work. For use on
steel they have slightly rounded edges to create sturdiness and resistance
to chipping and they rely on machine rigidity, horsepower and rpm to push
them through the material being machined. What you need for small lathes and
hobby use, regardless of the work material, is razor sharp edges which
you'll only find on uncoated (usually) non-ferrous carbide inserts. Edges
very similar to what you'd grind on HSS anyway. They will generally be
bright silver or perhaps carbide grey. If the tips you are using are gold,
black or any other dark colour they won't cut worth a damn on a small lathe
on most materials. They'll just push off the work and tear it to shreds.
What you have to appreciate is that what the carbide insert manuals and
guidelines mean by finishing cuts on a CNC lathe are still probably deeper
cuts than the roughing cuts most of us use on manual lathes.
If you stick with inserts designed for aluminium you'll get perfect results
on steel, cast iron, brass, bronze and just about anything else you want to
tickle away at a few thou at a time on a small lathe and the inserts will
last almost indefinitely if you don't abuse them. HSS might get the same
finish but it'll blunt every five minutes. If you want to take 4mm deep cuts
in EN40B then sure you need 10 hp and an insert designed for roughing steel.
I use a single carbide insert turning and facing tool with non ferrous tips
for 95% of the work I do on my Student. HSS has its uses when you need to
grind a special shape or make a very small boring tool for a one off job but
for most turning and facing I'd say get the largest shanked tool your lathe
can accept, some sharp non ferrous inserts to fit it and you can forget
buggering about on bench grinders every five minutes for the rest of your
life.
My mate's £50,000 CNC lathes can use a steel specific, rounded edge insert
and still get a mirror finish on hard materials like EN52B and 21/4N valve
steels. If I try to use the same insert on my Student it just buggers
everything it touches. My 40 year old machine has 50 times the backlash his
new ones do though, half the rpm, one tenth of the hp and no coolant. It's
just a matter of horses for courses.
If you want to spend your life learning how to sharpen tools rather than
actually cut metal then HSS is the very thing. You'll just die very
accomplished rather than having ever made anything.
--
Dave Baker
Puma Race Engines
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> A beginners thoughts:
>
> Most here seem to say buy blanks and grind your own.
>
> But, if you are a beginner isn't that just adding something else to learn
> and worry about? Is it not better for a beginner who already has a lathe
> to buy some ready to use tools so that they can get the hand of using the
> lathe first? Then later on learn to grind their own tools?