new to mig welding

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new to mig welding thms_hewitt 04-30-2007
Posted by on April 30, 2007, 8:29 pm
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hi.from down under.
Ihave just purchased a MAG MATE PRO 180 mig welder,but previous to
this i used the cheap gasless welders of which i was fairly proficiant
with, but with this new welder all has to be set by the user, such as
wire speed , amperage , gas flow, tip stickout length,( OH MY POOR
BRAIN) can anyone help me ? I have been to some of the other sites,
but what I am looking for is,
perhaps a book on the subject,can anyone shed any light on where i may
be able to get one or help me in any other way.
THANKING YOU IN ANTSIPATION
GOLDEN BOY
you can email me iff you like


Posted by Steve B on April 30, 2007, 9:34 pm
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> hi.from down under.
> Ihave just purchased a MAG MATE PRO 180 mig welder,but previous to
> this i used the cheap gasless welders of which i was fairly proficiant
> with, but with this new welder all has to be set by the user, such as
> wire speed , amperage , gas flow, tip stickout length,( OH MY POOR
> BRAIN) can anyone help me ? I have been to some of the other sites,
> but what I am looking for is,
> perhaps a book on the subject,can anyone shed any light on where i may
> be able to get one or help me in any other way.
> THANKING YOU IN ANTSIPATION
> GOLDEN BOY
> you can email me iff you like
>

Much information is going to be available on the inner side of the machine's
cover plate and in the manual.

Amperage and wire speed are on a chart and those are determined by the
thickness of the metal and the diameter of the wire, and the shielding gas
used.

As for stickout, stay with about 3/8" to 1'2". If you get too close, you'll
melt tips, and if you get too far, you'll see the wire heating up and
turning red.

Angles are critical, and vary greatly as to whether you are pushing,
pulling, traveling up or down, joint shape, lots of things. Books can get
you started, but just doing it teaches you so you'll remember.

Go by sound. What you want is a "frying bacon" sound, and not a splut splut
or any irregular sounds. And speaking of that, wear ear protection, as the
red hot molten BBs can cause you SEVERE grief if they get in your ear.

If you know anyone who knows how to weld, invite them over, provide some
adult beverage, and put some shrimp on the barbie, and they will show you
more in an evening than you'll learn in a week on your own.

Steve



Posted by Shaun Van Poecke on May 1, 2007, 6:01 am
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Hi Thomas (?),
Im in mt isa at the moment but grew up in sydney. If you're local ill give
you a lesson for a 6 pack, but none of that XXXX crap!

Here's a reply that i posted a while back for another guy in a similar
position to you. The advice therein is just as relevant.

If i were in your position, what i would do is seek out someone who is clued
up about welding and get them to show you a few things. you'll learn a lot
more in 10 minutes with someone who's in the know than you will in weeks of
tinkering and reading about it on the web. talking about welding is like
dancing about singing. Trade qualifications mean surprisingly little in
this area - ive met so many tradesmen in my time who have 20+ years in the
industry but still dont actually know how to set a welder. they often rely
on pencil marks on the welder itself for the settings, and they get crazy
mad if you adjust it!

There are no hard and fast fules about welding.... every material is
different, as is every weldment. a butt joint will require a different
setting from a mitre. as a general rule though, an outside mitre requires
about 30% less current than a butt joint while an inside mitre requires
about 30% more. vertical up requires a lot less heat than welding on the
flat or vertical down. All this talk is really pretty useless though except
in terms of a general understanding of more or less is required.

starting with gas coverage, about 15lpm is a good start. keep your nozzle
clean of spatter, aim your gun towards the direction of travel, and make
sure that you dont have any wind/fans blowing your shielding away.
shielding in itself is an art, but the basic points mean consistency.... a
consistent gun angle, avoiding jerky movements of the gun. since you have
come from gasless wire (flux core) you'll need to change your gun technique
a bit. fluc core usually uses a 'pull' gun technique where you drag the
gun, and a bit more stickout (the distance from the end of the tip to the
steel, or the length of wire hanging out of the tip). Solid wire with gas
on the other hand requires a bit less stickout, and a 'push' technique with
the gun.

removing the mill scale is nice, but most people rarely bother unless the
weld is to be certified. Im not familiar with your machine, but im assuming
that it has a few settings on the front for voltage, maybe A through E? If
so, your going to want to go with 'E' for anything 1/4" and over. 185 amps
really isnt much to work with, but with chamfering you could realistically
weld 1/2" material in a few passes.

so, start with your highest voltage setting. now, get close to the feeder.
hold the gun in which ever hand you normally use, and put the other hand on
the wire feed control. If your feeder has a '4 touch' setting or 'latch'
setting whereby once you press the trigger it keeps welding until you press
the trigger a second time, then use it. This is one of the secrets to
accurate consitent welding in all positions. start welding, and adjust the
wire while you are moving. turn it up to the point that the gun is kicking
back in your hand, making a machine gun sound..... this is too much wire.
now turn it down until it feels and sounds 'smooth', this is the earliest
point where it feels and sounds good to you. This setting will be a
slightly 'cold' or 'proud' bead. weld for a while, stop and have a look at
the bead.

now keep welding, and adjust it down further... keep going until it seems
to 'stall' and drip off the end of the wire... this is too low. but do a
weld anyway... look at the finished bead. notice the browning? see how
the spatter is really hard to remove? now weld again and turn it up, turn
it down... you dont want that dripping, but you dont want it kicking back.
while everything is a personal preference, and gun technique changes many
things, you will probably want a setting just above the 'drip' setting,
rather than just below the 'kick' setting.

as a general rule... more voltage = a flatter wider bead with more
penetration, while more wire *reduces* the amount of heat. in general, set
voltage for the penetration you want, and then adjust wire to suit. one way
of thinking of it is like this; the voltage digs a hole, the wire fills it
in. want more penetration? turn up voltage. Bead too proud? turn down
wire (fill in the hole less) or turn up voltage (digs a deeper hole for the
wire to fill up). too
cold? turn voltage up then adjust wire again. too hot? turn voltage down
and adjust wire to suit. browning would usually indicate too high a
voltage, or too little wire, or not enough shielding gas. the overall
verdict is too much heat. when you have excessive spatter, or the spatter
is really hard to scrape off but you have a good looking bead, its a sign
that you could probably tweak your wire a little bit.

every welder (machine) is a little bit different, even the same model.
every weldor (person) is also different. gun technique does make a huge
difference in the way the heat is applied, with gun angle, stickout and
weave being the main components. many weldors are really bad at setting
their welder, but very advanced at using gun techniques to increase or
reduce heat. My personal technique is very adaptable, but a signature of my
style is using a short forward step with a longer backstep for tha roll of
dimes effect. at higher currents (300amps+) i tend to avoid direct arc at
the edge of the bead, instead 'washing' the pool to the edge of the bead on
the backstep to avoid undercut.

Shaun




> hi.from down under.
> Ihave just purchased a MAG MATE PRO 180 mig welder,but previous to
> this i used the cheap gasless welders of which i was fairly proficiant
> with, but with this new welder all has to be set by the user, such as
> wire speed , amperage , gas flow, tip stickout length,( OH MY POOR
> BRAIN) can anyone help me ? I have been to some of the other sites,
> but what I am looking for is,
> perhaps a book on the subject,can anyone shed any light on where i may
> be able to get one or help me in any other way.
> THANKING YOU IN ANTSIPATION
> GOLDEN BOY
> you can email me iff you like
>



Posted by Gunner on May 1, 2007, 7:13 am
Please log in for more thread options
On Tue, 01 May 2007 10:01:15 GMT, "Shaun Van Poecke"


VERY nicely done Sir!


>Hi Thomas (?),
>Im in mt isa at the moment but grew up in sydney. If you're local ill give
>you a lesson for a 6 pack, but none of that XXXX crap!
>
>Here's a reply that i posted a while back for another guy in a similar
>position to you. The advice therein is just as relevant.
>
>If i were in your position, what i would do is seek out someone who is clued
>up about welding and get them to show you a few things. you'll learn a lot
>more in 10 minutes with someone who's in the know than you will in weeks of
>tinkering and reading about it on the web. talking about welding is like
>dancing about singing. Trade qualifications mean surprisingly little in
>this area - ive met so many tradesmen in my time who have 20+ years in the
>industry but still dont actually know how to set a welder. they often rely
>on pencil marks on the welder itself for the settings, and they get crazy
>mad if you adjust it!
>
>There are no hard and fast fules about welding.... every material is
>different, as is every weldment. a butt joint will require a different
>setting from a mitre. as a general rule though, an outside mitre requires
>about 30% less current than a butt joint while an inside mitre requires
>about 30% more. vertical up requires a lot less heat than welding on the
>flat or vertical down. All this talk is really pretty useless though except
>in terms of a general understanding of more or less is required.
>
>starting with gas coverage, about 15lpm is a good start. keep your nozzle
>clean of spatter, aim your gun towards the direction of travel, and make
>sure that you dont have any wind/fans blowing your shielding away.
>shielding in itself is an art, but the basic points mean consistency.... a
>consistent gun angle, avoiding jerky movements of the gun. since you have
>come from gasless wire (flux core) you'll need to change your gun technique
>a bit. fluc core usually uses a 'pull' gun technique where you drag the
>gun, and a bit more stickout (the distance from the end of the tip to the
>steel, or the length of wire hanging out of the tip). Solid wire with gas
>on the other hand requires a bit less stickout, and a 'push' technique with
>the gun.
>
>removing the mill scale is nice, but most people rarely bother unless the
>weld is to be certified. Im not familiar with your machine, but im assuming
>that it has a few settings on the front for voltage, maybe A through E? If
>so, your going to want to go with 'E' for anything 1/4" and over. 185 amps
>really isnt much to work with, but with chamfering you could realistically
>weld 1/2" material in a few passes.
>
>so, start with your highest voltage setting. now, get close to the feeder.
>hold the gun in which ever hand you normally use, and put the other hand on
>the wire feed control. If your feeder has a '4 touch' setting or 'latch'
>setting whereby once you press the trigger it keeps welding until you press
>the trigger a second time, then use it. This is one of the secrets to
>accurate consitent welding in all positions. start welding, and adjust the
>wire while you are moving. turn it up to the point that the gun is kicking
>back in your hand, making a machine gun sound..... this is too much wire.
>now turn it down until it feels and sounds 'smooth', this is the earliest
>point where it feels and sounds good to you. This setting will be a
>slightly 'cold' or 'proud' bead. weld for a while, stop and have a look at
>the bead.
>
>now keep welding, and adjust it down further... keep going until it seems
>to 'stall' and drip off the end of the wire... this is too low. but do a
>weld anyway... look at the finished bead. notice the browning? see how
>the spatter is really hard to remove? now weld again and turn it up, turn
>it down... you dont want that dripping, but you dont want it kicking back.
>while everything is a personal preference, and gun technique changes many
>things, you will probably want a setting just above the 'drip' setting,
>rather than just below the 'kick' setting.
>
>as a general rule... more voltage = a flatter wider bead with more
>penetration, while more wire *reduces* the amount of heat. in general, set
>voltage for the penetration you want, and then adjust wire to suit. one way
>of thinking of it is like this; the voltage digs a hole, the wire fills it
>in. want more penetration? turn up voltage. Bead too proud? turn down
>wire (fill in the hole less) or turn up voltage (digs a deeper hole for the
>wire to fill up). too
>cold? turn voltage up then adjust wire again. too hot? turn voltage down
>and adjust wire to suit. browning would usually indicate too high a
>voltage, or too little wire, or not enough shielding gas. the overall
>verdict is too much heat. when you have excessive spatter, or the spatter
>is really hard to scrape off but you have a good looking bead, its a sign
>that you could probably tweak your wire a little bit.
>
>every welder (machine) is a little bit different, even the same model.
>every weldor (person) is also different. gun technique does make a huge
>difference in the way the heat is applied, with gun angle, stickout and
>weave being the main components. many weldors are really bad at setting
>their welder, but very advanced at using gun techniques to increase or
>reduce heat. My personal technique is very adaptable, but a signature of my
>style is using a short forward step with a longer backstep for tha roll of
>dimes effect. at higher currents (300amps+) i tend to avoid direct arc at
>the edge of the bead, instead 'washing' the pool to the edge of the bead on
>the backstep to avoid undercut.
>
>Shaun
>
>
>
>
>> hi.from down under.
>> Ihave just purchased a MAG MATE PRO 180 mig welder,but previous to
>> this i used the cheap gasless welders of which i was fairly proficiant
>> with, but with this new welder all has to be set by the user, such as
>> wire speed , amperage , gas flow, tip stickout length,( OH MY POOR
>> BRAIN) can anyone help me ? I have been to some of the other sites,
>> but what I am looking for is,
>> perhaps a book on the subject,can anyone shed any light on where i may
>> be able to get one or help me in any other way.
>> THANKING YOU IN ANTSIPATION
>> GOLDEN BOY
>> you can email me iff you like
>>
>

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Posted by Balders on May 2, 2007, 6:19 am
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On Tue, 01 May 2007 10:01:15 GMT, Shaun Van Poecke wrote:

<snip useful stuff>

Hell, I'll buy you a beer or two for that!

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